Call —
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0:00 Caller: Hi, that. Happy Juneteen.
0:00 You: This call will be recorded.
0:04 You: Hey, Graham.
0:07 Caller: I don't know if that's what you're meant to say.
0:09 You: Happy June to you as well.
0:13 You: I don't think so, but anyway, glad I could connect.
0:14 Caller: Thanks.
0:19 Caller: Anyway.
0:20 Caller: Yeah, but yeah, I guess, so I've gathered your thoughts from just your previous feedback, pretty much, you know, like it felt like there was some alignment there.
0:20 You: I'm going to be.
0:32 Caller: So I guess where we're heading to, likely it will be the call next, and then they might ask you for an onsite, and then it will...
0:40 Caller: probably be done.
0:40 You: so
0:43 Caller: So the questions that I've got for you now was pretty much just on your thoughts on the role
0:49 Caller: as a whole.
0:50 Caller: If we were to put like money aside and conversation aside, how does this rank with your other
0:55 Caller: opportunities and then we can go from that.
1:00 Caller: Mm-hmm.
1:00 You: of the five as mentioned last time we spoke we're now down to four one backed out because the IP requirement is I hand over ownership of everything and they weren't willing to move so that's okay and then the other
1:07 Caller: Mm-hmm.
1:11 Caller: Mm.
1:13 Caller: Yeah. Mm-hmm.
1:17 Caller: Thank you.
1:20 Caller: Mm-hmm.
1:20 You: the other three it's waiting for their final round or in one case a super day so those are already all in the book they're all coming this coming week or one of them is the week following and then hopefully all first starts being extended or not
1:27 Caller: Yeah.
1:40 Caller: Yeah.
1:40 You: So in terms of Elliot's, you have all the terms, well, all the levers that I shared last time.
1:52 You: Are there any that I should be considering, perhaps, from the other placements you've made?
2:00 Caller: be something that Ben and I will have a conversation on after this just on the basis of
2:00 You: I don't know how I think.
2:07 Caller: we're trying to first gauge in terms of before we let Elliot pretty much know the compensation
2:16 Caller: levers which will be after this call you have with them
2:20 Caller: We just want to know before we pass on that information, the level of commitment you have to this role, per se, because at the end of the day, we understand that compensation is going to be a big lever for you, but at the same time, we need to know the essential potential risk that they might be that you might not accept the offering.
2:20 You: We're going to be.
2:40 Caller: comparison to your other opportunities should they come in and just so that we know pretty much
2:40 You: I don't know.
2:43 You: Dad, no.
2:46 Caller: that if Elliot come back to us as they in terms of his compensation numbers we're able to
2:50 Caller: hear all of that we want to make sure that when our client puts down that offer
2:55 Caller: that the chances are you're pretty much going to either say yes or going to be in a position
3:00 Caller: by it's going to be a likely yes do you know what i mean
3:00 You: Understood. So I suppose here's where Elliot is at a disadvantage. Being a hedge fund, I assume that I will not be able to actively manage my own portfolio. That's fine. What are the restrictions or those requirements? And what is Elliot offering to offset that?
3:20 Caller: Mm-hmm.
3:20 You: the second disadvantage the role as i understand it is predominantly in engineering or support it's not necessarily revenue generating and that's fine how is elliott going to how does eliot's i guess overcome that or explain the value
3:40 Caller: Uh-huh.
3:40 You: of the role in comparison to a different role that is more revenue generating or closer to revenue and then we went over the IP carve-outs let's see what other risks would Elliott have
3:49 Caller: Uh-huh.
3:50 Caller: Uh-huh.
3:55 Caller: Uh-huh.
4:00 Caller: Yeah, I think due to the fact that this is very greenfield, we're going to have to go
4:00 You: those are probably the main risks between elliot and the p e firms the other hedge fund is on well has similar restrictions that's the only reason why i know about at least some of them do you know if they have any others
4:20 Caller: find out those restrictions for you.
4:20 You: even if it wasn't the AI what other restrictions does Elliott typically have of their employees
4:22 Caller: So pretty much after this, I'll have a call with Ben.
4:26 Caller: We're pretty much going to.
4:33 Caller: So if it was trading, obviously,
4:36 Caller: there'd be known disclosure agreements.
4:38 Caller: But because your tooling would probably
4:40 Caller: most likely be, well, it's most likely going to be used by the software developers in the team,
4:40 You: We're going to be.
4:44 Caller: the levers are going to be completely different. I've not seen many developers be held down
4:52 Caller: to IP restrictions or engineers be held down to IP restrictions when it comes into developing
4:58 Caller: technology. So I think...
5:00 Caller: There won't be as strict restrictions as you would imagine, and to give you a bit more understanding on Elliot,
5:00 You: I want to go.
5:07 Caller: Elliot is more ensured on employing essentially their employee's happiness and on top of that the candidate experience.
5:14 Caller: So those are levers that essentially would need to be thought about by...
5:20 Caller: them to essentially make it more comfortable for you to pretty much accept an offer, they
5:20 You: Thank you.
5:25 Caller: would probably move certain levers.
5:27 Caller: But we first need to probe with Jim right after this, which is why I'm asking you these
5:34 Caller: questions because at the end of the day, up to your conversation, up to your next conversation,
5:40 Caller: we're unsure until the super day pretty much whether you're we pretty much think you're at that
5:40 You: Thank you.
5:44 Caller: 60% range pretty much at almost an offer but once you have this conversation with david
5:52 Caller: and david comes back and says yes well done he's great all of that then we obviously need
5:58 Caller: to know what these levers are
6:00 Caller: So ideally what we want to do is have these questions answered while you're speaking, well, just before you speak to David or while you're speaking to David, so that it's a linear process whereby as soon as you're done with your conversation with David, we can come back and say to you, okay, these are the answers on the questions you've got, on a compensation standpoint, on an IP standpoint, and all of that. And if there's any
6:00 You: We're going to be.
6:20 Caller: other pretty much restrictions on others this is what they may be and this is
6:20 You: I'm going to be.
6:22 You: We're going to be.
6:24 Caller: what they pretty much have lacks and freedom for you to kind of work and roam
6:27 Caller: once we get all those answers for you that I can pretty much give you a
6:31 Caller: definitive answer it was just a matter of gauging what are the restrictions what
6:35 Caller: are the needles we need to move for you to get you to a point where you're pretty
6:38 Caller: much at close to an age
6:40 Caller: 80, 90, 95% point where you could say,
6:40 You: understood then i get well the only other real uncertainty for me the problem that the role described establishing a i s dLC i'm of the opinion a solution can be reached within six to
6:42 Caller: if Elliot were to put all of that down
6:44 Caller: in front of the mean writing, I'll likely accept.
7:00 Caller: Mm-hmm.
7:00 You: nine months. And that's after maybe three months of iterating through all the bad solutions.
7:06 You: The intent for the role, as it was supposed to be, I believe, 10 years plus in seat.
7:07 Caller: Mm-hmm.
7:12 Caller: Mm-hmm.
7:12 You: So what happened for the remaining nine and a quarter years?
7:15 Caller: Yeah. So as you can imagine.
7:20 Caller: imagine that is pretty much like how hedge funds work as soon as you probably complete the
7:20 You: You know,
7:26 Caller: solution of what they're needing to do similar to how they started speaking to you about
7:31 Caller: adapt similar to how they'll probably look into pretty much looking at AI throughout the
7:36 Caller: firm as a whole i don't think your role would be pitching
7:40 Caller: holds to just AISDLC within their software development team.
7:40 You: I don't know.
7:42 You: We're going to be.
7:44 Caller: I think it will then extend to AISDLC across law management, security,
7:50 Caller: and wider, essentially wider ends of the firm.
7:53 Caller: Essentially that we can also get an answer for you once we pose the question
7:57 Caller: and probably the chances are that is a question.
8:00 Caller: question that you can also pose to David, because obviously David is head of software development at the firm and has an idea of where Alpha, I mean, sorry, not Alpha, but artificial intelligence is going and where they would essentially need to move you across should AISD or CP done within a six to nine month period.
8:00 You: Thank you.
8:20 Caller: Yeah.
8:20 You: I hesitate to bring that goal only because of the hubris that may be associated with it.
8:27 Caller: I think there's ways to ask that question without it pointing to you saying that you feel like the task is going to be done in six to nine months.
8:39 Caller: I think what you kind of
8:40 Caller: The grand phrase is the idea that with AI, like for example, we see it now, six months ago I couldn't get clodged to go onto my computer and start mapping things, but now I can.
8:40 You: Thank you.
8:54 Caller: The advancement has gone from me pretty much having two screens, one working with the AI and the other one, you know.
9:00 Caller: me doing the human side of things to now me having one screen where I can see what the AI is doing.
9:00 You: and
9:01 You: you know
9:02 You: I'm
9:03 You: I'm
9:04 You: Thank you.
9:05 Caller: And I'm also doing the human side of things at the same time.
9:07 Caller: That advancement happened pretty quickly.
9:09 Caller: So you could phase the question around that.
9:12 Caller: Should we advance fairly quickly?
9:15 Caller: And AI takes us to a point where we essentially can complete this task.
9:20 Caller: within a year or two years of time,
9:20 You: I see.
9:22 Caller: instead of you saying six months,
9:24 Caller: what does the role then stretch to?
9:26 Caller: Because the only person who can probably answer that question
9:28 Caller: is head of software department on the firm.
9:33 You: What's the distinction between Brett and David?
9:34 Caller: You don't need it to, you don't need to, mm-hmm,
9:38 Caller: sorry.
9:40 Caller: So global head essentially means he runs every one of Elliot's locations, like he's the main point for each and every firm, whereas David is head whereby he might be just tied to New York, London.
9:40 You: I believe Brett was global head of software and David is head of software.
10:00 Caller: the main kind of offices, but obviously it would just be somebody who's directly underneath
10:00 You: You know,
10:01 You: I'm going to
10:02 You: I'm
10:04 You: I don't know.
10:04 Caller: it. The levels might not be that different. It's just like, if you imagine what an investment
10:05 You: It's just
10:06 You: I'm
10:08 You: Thank you.
10:10 Caller: banks looks like where it's like head of investment banking and then you have a co-head of
10:15 Caller: investment banking, but the co-head is slightly more junior than the head. Think of it.
10:20 Caller: like that. I don't think there's that much of a massive distinction. It's just that when you speak of
10:20 You: so david is technically junior to brett or in brett's reporting line or not necessarily
10:25 Caller: senior buying, probably the two main people who would pretty much be discussing anything to do with
10:30 Caller: software development. It would likely be Brett and Davis. Yeah.
10:40 Caller: Yeah, I'd say doesn't necessarily need to be in reporting line, I'd say if they were to have a conversation about where software development is going to go for the next five to ten years in the firm, the two people who pretty much have to sit in a room and chat to each other, probably be those two, and then whatever direction that comes out.
10:40 You: Thank you.
11:00 Caller: of those two that will then be trickled down to people like you, head of DevOps and stuff like that.
11:00 You: Understood.
11:07 You: Okay.
11:11 Caller: All right.
11:13 You: Then I think you have what you need.
11:14 Caller: I'd say though feel like the fever.
11:17 You: Sorry, go ahead.
11:18 Caller: Yeah.
11:20 Caller: The feedback around your profile is very positive.
11:20 You: Thank you.
11:23 Caller: Everybody, I think, is well aware of your commercial strengths and your technical strength.
11:27 Caller: I think you've now hit a point whereby you can feel slightly confident in the questions that you ask.
11:33 Caller: Obviously, without the hubris part, because I know you're trying to balance that out.
11:38 Caller: But
11:40 Caller: I think you're at a point where they're very keen on your profile, so do feel like you can ask the questions that you do need to ask to feel comfortable, especially with regards to where this position is going to go to in a long time.
11:40 You: We're going to be.
11:42 You: We're going to be.
11:44 You: We're going to be.
11:46 You: I'm going to go.
11:48 You: I'm going to
11:50 You: I don't know.
11:52 You: Thank you.
11:54 You: Thank you.
11:56 You: Thank you.
11:57 Caller: So if you feel that that is a question, you need to...
12:00 Caller: ask genuinely that is a very good question to ask where do you what the success
12:00 You: Thank you.
12:04 Caller: look like for you with me in a year or two years time feel free to ask that
12:09 Caller: question because at the end of the day a lot of employers find that question
12:12 Caller: very good like what the success looks like after a year if they can give you an
12:16 Caller: answer then say okay what about after five years and if we can give you a
12:20 Caller: our story again then great at least you know that they're thinking along those lines for you
12:20 You: Okay, I'll keep that in mind.
12:25 Caller: and they know that you're thinking along the lines of essentially staying with them for a pretty
12:30 Caller: long period of time all right all right i'll leave you to it have a great day with your son
12:38 Caller: and thanks for taking the time with me all right
12:40 Caller: Good one.
12:40 You: All right. Thank you, Graham. Take care.
12:41 Caller: Thank you.
12:42 Caller: Thank you.